See You In The AM:
A Mental Health Podcast
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Episode: Connecting with Your Inner Nerd with Kris Quintana
Show Notes
"What you think is your weakness is really your superpower. And that really is ... your inner nerd, but it's letting that out in a way that that quality of you gets to shine as a strength and you can learn to appreciate yourself that way and allow yourself to be more you."
In today's episode, we will discuss connecting with your inner nerd with Aspyn Coach Kris Quintana. Kris is a certified High-Performance Coach, a World Champion martial artist, and a master instructor, and her background includes years of teaching about leadership, self-discipline, and resilience through martial arts training. Her work focuses on helping her clients find energy, clarity, and consistency to keep moving forward.
Helpful links from the episode:
- Good Inside: A Guide to Becoming the Parent You Want to Be by Dr. Becky Kennedy
- How to Be You: Stop Trying to Be Someone Else and Start Living Your Life by Jeffrey Marsh
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Transcript
Allie Nickle:
Hello and welcome to the See You in the AM podcast,where we explore the many facets of mental health and wellness,share our personal experiences,interview mental health experts,and offer practical tips and resources to help you prioritize your mental wellness.I'm your co-host,Allie Nickle from Aspyn Market,and I'm joined by my friend,business partner and founder of Aspyn Market Wynter Johnson.We know there are a lot of mental health resources out there and it's overwhelming to find the right resources that fit your needs,time and budget.So we're here to help.In each episode we'll talk with one of Aspyn Market's mental health experts,and dig into a mental health topic that we know so many of us struggle with.In today's episode,we'll discuss connecting with your inner nerd with Aspyn Coach Kris Quintana.Kris is a certified high performance coach and a world champion martial artist and master instructor.And her background includes years of teaching about leadership,self-discipline,and resilience through martial arts training.Her work focuses on helping her clients find energy,clarity,and consistency to keep moving forward.
Kris Quintana:
Hi,Allie.Thanks so much for having me.And hi.With you too.I should be saying hi to you
Allie Nickle:
both.Yes,absolutely.Uh,I am super excited,uh,I,um,being a nerd myself,I'm very excited to see where this conversation goes.Uh,so with that,I'll hand it over to Wynter to start us off.
Wynter Johnson:
Yes.Hi Kris.We are so excited to have you here and to be talking about inner nerd and I was really excited to to,to talk about this topic today because until I was probably in my early,early twenties,mid twenties,you know,being a nerd,you kind of have that,that um,feel those feelings from school come up,you know,when kids called other kids nerd and you don't feel great about it.And I interviewed with this amazing company once and they had a coach that sat in in all the interviews and he said,you have some inner nerd in you,don't you?And I said,I do.And he said,this is great.And they ended up offering me the job.And it was the first time I thought,okay,wait,inner nerd can be really powerful.And so I'm excited to talk to you today.Um,but before we dig into all of that,I would really love to know more about you,your coaching,your background in martial arts,just,just everything about you.
Kris Quintana:
Oh my goodness.Now,first thing about me,never give me that much leeway.I'll talk for45minutes.Um,wow.Okay,so where to start?Uh,okay,so the martial arts thing,we'll start there because Allie mentioned,I think Allie mentioned the world champion thing.Um,I am who I have been a martial artist since1990.90,since1990.Um,I have,I tried three different martial arts before I fell into the one that I'm in now,and I've been doing that,it'll be30years this November of the same martial art.Um,it's a martial art called Kuk Sool.I currently study the branch of Kuk Sool called Mirae Kuk Sool,which is honestly brand new.And super exciting.Um,that's a whole other story and we won't go there on this at this point probably.Um,but I was a world champion in2001.In fact,it was October of2001.So part of my training overlapped the Twin Towers,um,falling down.And uh,it was a really intense time,I think communally and culturally.And,um,I was the kid growing up.I always dreamed of being a competitor,like an Olympic competitor,but not because I ever wanted to win anything,but because I wanted to work out.Like in the seventies,they used to show us these videos of like Nadia Comăneci and all these people and all they did was their thing.Like they didn't go to real school and they got to do ballet and they got to choose gymnastics.And that was their whole life.And I thought,whoa,that would be so cool.So for me,going after that grand championship started as a way to prioritize my training and being able to do it every single day,no matter what was going on,and really get into the training.But then the towers fell and it sort of became like,um,I'm not letting it stop me.Like I had this whole moment of is this even worth doing?The world is going going crazy and should I be going to this competition?And I thought,no,this is us saying like,we're gonna still do the things that we do.Um,and so I went and went to the competition.So you know,it was,had something to do with the time as well as the activity of doing it.And it just felt really important to do.Um,and so,you know,on the one hand,wow,that was so long ago.Why am I still talking about it?But on the other hand,it really was formative and there's a lot of times where it's like,well this is hard,but it's not harder than what I went through in2001.So I know that I can do this.And,um,so.You know,it's,it's a favorite coaching question.When was a,think of a time when you've,you know,been your best self.I'm like,okay,2001got that championship.So,um,yeah,there was a lot of really great learning in that and there's a lot of things I draw on when I'm talking to people about it.It's been a really good foundation.Um,I stopped teaching because of a concussion not from the martial art that I got five years ago.And the environment of being on the mat was just too chaotic for me.So I moved into coaching because it's more one-on-one and even when it's group,it's not as chaotic as14four year olds running around being told to be louder.Cuz that was my job is be louder.Um,so it's a much calmer environment,um,to be a coach,but I still get all of that same sense of contribution and being able to help people.
Wynter Johnson:
I love that and saying,you know,think of a time when you did something amazing or think of a time in your life when you felt good and remember that you can do this is a really,really powerful message.Because I think that there's times,and I think a lot of people are going through those times right now as we transition and we watch the world transition where we think,can I do this?And knowing I have done this and I can do this is really,really impactful.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah,and I think martial arts,I've been such a great metaphor for that all my life,um,or all of my adult life because,um,right now I'm starting something newish.I haven't been a coach for as long as I've been a martial artist,so it feels very new.And that is a very humbling experience.But I remember being a white belt,and I remember watching every one of my students step onto the mat for the first time as a white belt,and the courage that that takes and what it takes to be a beginner at something.And then you finally achieve and you get your yellow belt,and now you have color in your belt and you've made it,but you're in a brand new class and you have to learn all new things and it feels uncomfortable again.And so over and over in a martial arts journey,you're,you're achieving,you're proud of yourself.You have short goals,like a big goal,black belt broken down into small goals.All the things we teach in coaching,right?It's manifested on the mat and it's walked out in real time in a martial arts studio,which is why I loved doing that for so long.But you know,it's just a reminder.Um,A white belt.Again,I'm a color belt,so I have some experience I can help other people,but I still have a long way to go.And that feeling of,I've done this over and over and over again because I'm in one of those phases right now of can I really do this?My life is so different today than it was two,five years ago.Can I really do this?But yeah,uh,we,I,I've done it before,so I must be able to do it again.
Wynter Johnson:
I love that.You know,and I,my youngest son is into TaeKwonDo and af after every belt,you're right,he's like,can I do this?You can do this.You just did this.You did this5,6,7times already.You've got this.And so I love taking the bigger goal and breaking it down,which is really hard to do.Sometimes.It can feel big until you break it down in those little steps.
Kris Quintana:
You know what I wish too though,was that somehow in real life we could wear signs that tell people where we're at.Like,nobody expects a white belt to look like a black belt.So when a white belt makes a bunch of mistakes that they're going,oh,that's a dumb mistake.We don't go,that's a dumb mistake.We go,that's the exact same mistake everybody makes.At that point,you're a beginner,right?And then we get,we have all like couple years experience under our belt.So now it's a very much darker color.So people can look at us and go,oh,I can,I can ask that person for help.But other people look at us and say they might need my help.And I kind of just wish we had color codes for life like that.So we knew who we could reach up to and who we needed to reach down to.And that we gave ourselves more permission to make mistakes.Like I used to say,I didn't even realize I said it.One of my adult students pointed out to me that it was one of her favorite expressions.So I used to say,you're making the right mistake.
Wynter Johnson:
I love that saying,
Kris Quintana:
and,and if you think about it,Anybody with more experience than you knows exactly what mistakes you're going to make on,you know,if you have kids,what,not every single mistake,but you have a sense of what are the kinds of mistakes they're going to make at fourth grade,at sixth grade,at12th grade event,you know,you've been there so you know what to expect a little bit.So we look at it as the end of the world,cuz we've never done it before,but somebody looking back at us is like,well that's the right mistake.That's how you're gonna learn.That's the lesson you need to learn.That's perfect cuz I see you making that mistake.It tells me you're following these things.Allie,you look like you wanna say something.
Allie Nickle:
Oh,I was just gonna jump in and say I,I'm getting super excited about all this.Um,so I have a three,almost four year old and um,one of the things I've really been focused on is I grew up being a people pleaser,a perfectionist,and,um,from some of the books I've been reading,one of them is Good Inside,um,we can link to it in the show notes,but it talks about how reward the effort,not the result.And I think this is exactly what you're getting at with mistakes and everything is,you know,saying that's okay,that's how you learn.You fall down,you get back up again.But again,recognizing that effort of,but you did get back up again.Not that's the expectation,but you,you figured out how to do it.You figured out how to correct it.And I think there's so much room for that right now with everybody.I'm using the analogy of my toddler,but with,with grownups,with human beings in general,recognizing there's always mistakes be made.There's always lessons to be learned,but that's where the,the important part is.It's not okay,then you finally figured it out.It's,you figured out how to get there.
Kris Quintana:
Mm-hmm.Yeah.And I think for me,the challenge always was the teenagers because they look like adults.And so it was sometimes it's much easier to look like,look at a toddler and remember to be kind and gentler and that they were gonna do all these things.And then you get these teenagers who's like95%of the time are just fine.And then they do like,what are you thinking kind of things.And you're like,right,that's a teen.Like as the words you should know better are coming out your mouth.The,the other side of your brain is like,no,they shouldn't,that,that's not like,right.And,and to be able to give ourselves and everybody around us that grace all the time.I mean,yes,we wanna be age appropriate in the conversations that we have with people.So we're not talking down to someone,but we're not giving them too much information.But at the same time,wouldn't it be nice if we were all as kind to each other as we are to the little ones like,little one's having a temper tantrum,that's fine.I mean,it can be annoying,but we know what they're regulating and we have to help them learn to regulate.Well,what about us when we're completely dysregulated,why can't we honor that somehow?
Wynter Johnson:
Why can't we honor that for ourselves?I think there's a lot there.Like yeah,our journey would be great,but since we can't do that,I think we can personally take responsibility for sharing where we are in our journey,you know?And I think when you are in a safe space,you're in the right space,you have the right people in your world,you feel comfortable saying,I don't know this,or I did this and it didn't work,or I really need some help with this,or I've been there,I can help you with that.And so unfortunately,I don't think that's something a lot of us get comfortable with until we're a bit older and in the right environment.You know,Allie and I came from a really safe space at our last company where there were times where things just went wrong.They just did.And the questions were around.Did you think through it?Did you try your hardest?And if you,if those two things.Yes.I thought through it.I tried my hardest.Then it happened.Let's start over.Let's see how we can learn from this and how are we gonna do it differently next time?But I don't think you always find yourself in those spaces or have the confidence to express what you need or how you feel.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.And I think that's so important.Um,I.One of my mentors,uh,Dr.Robin Silverman,she does,um,how to talk to kids about anything.And she's got a book coming out on it.Um,she used to say like,when kids make mistakes,yay,you're one step closer.Yay,you're one fail.You know?Right?Like you're one fail closer,like you celebrate the win.Um,we did an in,I did a improv class actually once with my leadership team where we did that where the first rule of improv was you have to celebrate the win.So minute you,if you made a mistake,you had to go yay me,I made a mistake.Like it got to be the greatest thing.It was so uncomfortable for the team at the beginning,but by,you know,within20minutes it was natural and it carried over and it was such an awesome lesson to learn of,you know,not just the,I don't know,which is open-mindedness and brilliant also,but,um,to be able to celebrate mistakes and learn to be okay with them.
Wynter Johnson:
As the mom of a teenager,I need to remember that and figure out how to celebrate those,those life lessons.
Kris Quintana:
Well,I think at the teenager,sometimes that's scarier to do cuz they're,it feels like there's more at stake.The older we get with our mistakes,the more it feels like there's a lot at stake.So give yourself a little bit of room for that too.But yeah,definitely thinking about it.I mean,if it's the right size mistake and if it's the right mistake,uh,some mistakes are not the right mistakes,but you know,at some point a teenager's gonna have their heart broken.That's the right mistake.
Wynter Johnson:
Yes.Life lessons.There's a lot of life lessons in that age.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.Yeah.
Wynter Johnson:
Okay.But let's dig into inner nerd.Ok.So when you say into inner nerd,I think that's another thing that comes with age is really knowing what your inner nerd is.And I think that's another thing where when you're surrounded by the right group,right places,right people,your inner nerd can really shine.But how do you recommend we recognize and connect with our inner nerd?And what does that really mean to do that?
Kris Quintana:
I love that question.Um,well,you said so many things.I love what you said about the right people being around you,making that feel safer.Um,for me,the inner nerd idea.To get really,really,really good at something,you have to get into the weeds with it.And most of us have a thing that we will turtle totally nerd out about.And a lot of us have an experience in middle school or high school where we're made fun of for that thing that we're so much more into than everybody else.Like in a high school,I would've just defined myself as a drama nerd.I was a theater department.Like that was my thing.I was also like a book nerd.I,I had to get good grades cuz that was the perfectionist in me.But I didn't identify that.I identify drama nerd,like that was the place I belonged as I was over the years working with teenagers,I realized that they kids,the teens today,I guess the older Gen Z,younger millennials,I don't know where the cutoff is anymore.Um,they don't see it the way you,we see it like as nerd is necessarily a bad word,like a negative thing.Um,some,sometimes we do.So for me,the inner nerd,as opposed to your outer nerd is the thing you hide away.The inner nerd is the whatever it is.Whether you think it's a nerdy thing or not,it's the thing you hide away that at some point in your life,even if you don't feel that way today,maybe you feel that way today.Either you wish you could be different or you just wish you didn't have to be different.You know,like,like this is who I am and it hurts to be me out and in the world.Or I'm afraid to be me out in the world that maybe I haven't been hurt,but I saw someone else get picked on for being big and bold and you know,whatever,and I need to be quieter.Maybe I've heard too many times girls don't do that.Maybe it was weird when.I was little and my big sister was playing dress up,and I wanted to,but I was a boy,but I couldn't,you know,whatever it was,there's something inside of us that wants to get out and it's saying,let me out,I can do this.And every once in a while we let that piece out and we're like,whoa,that was cool.But there's this voice in our head.This is not safe.To me,that's the inner nerd and connecting with that is learning how to embrace it and to understand it and to find the safety that you were talking about,to be able to let it show.And sometimes we let it show in very small ways because sometimes it's not safe.Right.I know.Um,I,I have a,uh,um,someone in my distantly in my life whose trans kid didn't come out but invited them in.Because in the world that they live in,it's not safe enough for that kid to come out yet.So that's a step,I mean,at least now there's someone supporting and saying,you're valid.You're valuable.I still love you.And,and building that up.But like,that's kind of an ex more extreme example,I guess.Uh,although it's not,it's probably very common.But,um,you know,there's also the,the little voice that like,I want to,I wanna start a podcast.Nobody wants to listen to me.I don't have anything valuable to say.I talk too much anyway.Right.That inner nerd.And so when we can embrace that and let it out,A lot of times,and I got this from this piece I got from Jeffrey Marsh's book,um,How To Be You.I love them.Um,but Jeffrey talks a lot about how to and how to be you.The idea of what you think is your weakness is really your superpower.And that really is part of how the heroes part came into nerds and heroes is it's not just your inner nerd,but it's letting that out in a way that that quality of you gets to shine as a strength and you can learn to appreciate yourself that way and allow yourself to be more,you.
Wynter Johnson:
Your weakness is a superpower.And I think the,the sooner we identify that,the sooner we get comfortable with that.The sooner we can embrace and grow that.Is that an accurate statement there?
Kris Quintana:
Absolutely.The sooner,the better.Um,I figured out I was a nerd.I don't know.I started playing the personal development world at nine,so,um,I had a huge headstart on a lot of people,and that aspect of me made me the weirdest kid in school,um,because nobody else was doing this and nobody else's parents were doing it.Like my mom was meditating and my friends were like,can I,is your mom,your mom's meditating right now?Can I see what it looks like?It looks like she's sleeping,but can I see.Oh,okay.Cracked the door open.Like we,I was just weird because I was into,so like yeah,the younger,the better.Um,and I think,you know,a tangible example,cuz if we're just saying your weakness is your superpower,that's kind of hard to hone in on and connect with.Like for me,the first thing that came to mind when I was thinking about how do I make this more tangible is a friend of mine who says I'm terrible at organization,my house is a complete mess and I'm trying to learn systems to help teach my kids and to help manage the house.And it's so frustrating cuz I'm so bad at it.And okay,so he would say,my weakness is organization.But what that means is he can handle chaos,right?Life is not always organized.If you're a disorganized person,you're comfortable with chaos,that's a superpower.Allie just got it.Ooh,you just got
Allie Nickle:
that,that just clicked.Yeah.Okay.I,I don't,I don't have a follow up to that other than Yep.That just clicked for me.I don't feel so bad when my desk is a mess.
Kris Quintana:
Everybody has a different way of doing things anyway,but that's a whole other conversation.My desk right now is horrifying,but I don't like that it's messy.Um,cuz I used to be organized,and this is a brain injury thing.Okay.And my husband's probably laughing and my mother in her grave is probably laughing because I probably was never as organized as I think I was.But,um,I would prefer that it was organized.But,um,yeah,so that,I mean that's like one really tangible example.Um,the other one I said before was like the voice in your head that says,well,they always told me I talk too much.They always told me nobody wants to hear what I have to say,so I shouldn't start that podcast.I shouldn't write that blog.Um,I mean,we grow up with messages in our head.We all have'em.Um,our kids all have'em.And no matter how well we try as parents and teachers,not to repeat it,we're not perfect.So our kids hear some of'em,but,you know,whatever the message is that tells us we need to be perfect,that we can't be who we are.Like I'm sure if you think about it,you know what your tape is like,we have a tape and we just need to change the tape.
Wynter Johnson:
How do you change that tape?And,you know,I have a12year old son who a couple weeks ago said to me,well,I can't do that because Mrs.So-and-So said I'm not good at it.And Mrs.So-and-so was his second grade teacher,and he has carried that with him for years and years thinking I can't do that and doesn't even try.So how do you break that loop,change that tape in kids and adults and yourself?
Kris Quintana:
Wow.Okay.Wow.That is such a great example because we don't realize what we carry with us.Um,I think changing the tape is an act of courage and an act of consistency and,all right,I don't think you guys are as old as me,but do,are you guys old enough to remember Philip Smally from Saturday Night Live?I'm good enough.I'm smart enough and gosh darn it,people like me.Yes.Okay.Affirmations work,I mean,we make fun of'em,but affirmations work,you have to rewrite.So we're talking about a tape and in case there's any teenagers looking way back before we had playlists,we have these round disks we called CDs.And even before that,they were these things that were plastic and had a piece of recording tape through them,and that's what we're talking about.Okay,so you have to record over it,right?I mean,think about it.When I used to,since I'm using the word tape,uh,I used to stick the tape in the VCR and it would like,I wanna watch cinderella and that's Top Gun.I love Top Gun,but I wanted Cinderella.I don't go,oh my God,it's Top Gun.I can't handle it.I take the tape out and I put Cinderella in.So on some level it's that simple.But simple doesn't mean easy and you just have to replace the message over and over again.If it were a coaching conversation that I were having with a kid who said,I can't do that cuz my second grade teacher said I was never gonna be good at it,I would say,you know,has there been anything in the last10years that you've discovered Mrs.So-and-So was wrong about?Is it possible she was wrong about this?Let's pretend or even not ask that one in case he says no.Let's pretend for a minute she made a mistake.If she had never said that,what could you do if you knew you couldn't fail?What would you do?Why don't we try that?Because maybe,maybe it was true then and it isn't true now.You're a different person now than you were then.But it becomes an act of exploring because to some degree,what we say to another person doesn't always stick,but what they say to themselves sticks better.So if you can get your kid to tell you,it's better to have his voice replacing the tape.I mean,your voice replacing the tape is beautiful.But if you can layer on top of that,his voice,you did say it was your son,right?Sorry.Um,his voice on top of it.So he's hearing himself say it,you know,affirmations are corny.Good luck getting any12year old to do that.But,um,you know,just in a conversation and then look for the wins.Look for how many examples can you find between second grade and now as mom,where he already proved that teacher wrong and he's already come close to doing this thing he says he can't do.
Wynter Johnson:
Well,and you say affirmations are corny,but I love them.One of the first things I did with the first coach I worked with was create an affirmation that I still use to this day.Um,and I've had a couple with my kids that I use and I say them all the time and I hear them sometimes saying them to each other or saying them out loud to themselves.And I was like,okay,there's hope that some of these are getting in there.So yeah,we,we think we're corny people make fun of them.I I They are powerful.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.Leave a note.And,and you know,that might be a good way to ask him,like,if you were gonna replace that tape,if you wanted to actively change that story.That's another thing Dr.Robin has,has taught me over the years.It's like,that's a story that you're telling yourself.Let's write a different one.If you were gonna write a different story,what would you say?And then maybe he,there's an affirmation in that,right?That's part of the nerds and the heroes.We're gonna be the hero of our own story.Or maybe we're the hero of someone else's story and not our own.But if we look at it from a comic book point of view,can't we,we get to change it.We're in charge.We can be the writer,not the person stuck inside of the box.Right?So if we wanted to change that story,what would we change it to?And then maybe there's an affirmation that can help support that and be a reminder of that along the way.
Wynter Johnson:
Well,and I think in creating that story,one of the comments you made a few minutes ago was,what would you do if you knew you couldn't fail?Yeah.The story in the safe lane looks very different than changing the story in a way that you actually want the story to change.Uh,I think a lot of us can make decisions or move in directions that are fear-based.We're too scared to go for direction A,so we settle for B.And so it's really interesting to ask yourself to break through that fear of what do I actually really want?Instead of what do I feel safe doing?
Kris Quintana:
I think you have to ask both questions.I think you have to start with,what do I really want?If I knew I couldn't fail,what would I do?If I knew I couldn't fail?I would,I don't know,um,I would write a book.If I knew that it was gonna be worth my time,I wasn't gonna go broke.It was gonna sell.It was gonna be useful to someone.I would write a book that's my blue sky thing.That thought terrifies me.So what's the smallest step I can take towards that,given the fear that I'm feeling?
Wynter Johnson:
Well and there we go to breaking down goals into steps,which I love.
Kris Quintana:
Exactly.And that's why you have to ask both questions because fear is a healthy thing.Fear is not something to be avoided or ignored.Fear that's misplaced needs to be adjusted.But fear exists for a reason and sometimes it needs to be listened to.And so we don't wanna just bypass it.I'm very,very leery of,of bypassing.Um,but we can say,what's the stretch?And then what's the first step towards that?Sometimes we don't even know what's beyond that step.Like what I'm doing right now in my life is step one towards a huge vision.I have no idea what steps two through that vision are.I just know what step one is,and that's all as far as I can see.And so that's the step I'm taking and I'm kind of trusting in the universe and God and whatever we wanna call it,that I'm on the right,heading in the right direction.
Allie Nickle:
Well,and along those lines,one of the things I've been trying to practice lately is giving it a name,giving it a title.So an example of facing that fear of we're gonna start a podcast,which is exactly what we're doing right now,instead of,you know,thinking of it that way and all the different steps and making it really big.It's,no,I'm a storyteller.I am talking to people and getting a message out there and helping people with it.And that makes it more approachable when you give it that name of being a powerful storyteller.Not I'm launching a podcast.Who's gonna listen to it?What am I doing with this?How are we gonna do it?What are the logistics behind it of No,I'm a storyteller.And then just head
Kris Quintana:
at your inner nerd.Yes.And that's your inner nerd.I love that.Identifying who you are instead of what you're gonna do.Yes.Beautiful.
Wynter Johnson:
So how can you help other people in your world embrace their inner nerd?
Kris Quintana:
Um,celebrate the things you like about them.Um,help them see their strengths when they're focused on their weaknesses and vehemently deny and argue against the criticism that they're hearing that you disagree with.Um,so for example,I was in my church small group and someone was saying,we were talking about fear and we were talking about courage,and we were talking about,um,not shrinking from what we're called to do.And she was like,I just feel so lost.I don't know what I do well,I'm just in this phase phase where I'm so tired all the time.I just don't think I'm doing anything.I'm not moving towards my calling.And I was like,okay,woman,stop.You've shown up this way,that way.And I started naming very specific things that she's been doing in the middle of e whatever's going on in her life right now.And I,you know,it's,it just recognize what people are doing well and re and,and reaffirm it and support it and encourage it as much as we can.I think that's how anyone can help someone connect to their inner nerd is just like,we can't tell someone what it is,but if someone says,oh,I'm thinking about doing X.Wow,that's so cool.What's that about for you?Like be curious with them and explore with them and just support it.I mean,if we look at people and we see who they are and we're willing to see them,it helps them see themselves.
Wynter Johnson:
I love that being able to see people for who they really are and letting them be that,you know,I think a lot of times we're told what we should be and that kind of,you know,forces our inner nerd back into hiding even more.Um,until,you know,we are okay saying,this is me and this is how I'm gonna show up today.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.We're told what we should be and also how to be that.I,I got a lot of messaging in my childhood about,um,the right way to be a girl.And,um,and it,you know,I fought against it for a really long time and,um,my stepmom pointed out to me one day that,um,it's my thing on Instagram that I don't wear makeup ever.And I was like,no,that's not actually intentional.That's sort of just life.Um,but I sort of liked it too.Um,I mean,I do sometimes,but I don't care.I.Because that's part of how I decided I was going to be female in this world.I mean,I was identified female at birth and I still am,but this is how I'm doing it.And I was a tomboy and I was a whatever and I had my hair short and I wa I go by Kris instead of Kristen because of,you know,and all of these things.And I wasn't allowed to play sports cuz girls don't play sports.And it was only the seventies and you know,all of those things that I fought so hard to get to.But even today as a grownup woman,I have to figure out what does that mean?How do I wanna show up every day?Having been given all of these messages from both sides,all of these messages from the world,like women can't do this.And all of these messages from my mom and my aunt and these powerful women,a generation ahead who were trailblazing for me,who had expectations of how I was gonna live up to that.Like I can only be me.And eventually that's what happens.But I think we do.We just get so many messages of what should you be?How should you be that?And to find people,we need people around us who can support us.So if you know to find your own inner nerd,get around the people that support who you are and your vision of you,and to help bring it out in another person,just accept who they are.And my way of doing things is not yours,Wynter or yours,Allie.And that's okay.I wanna help you be the best you.I don't wanna turn you into a mini me.I never even wanted to turn my mini me into a me,mini me.It just sort of was what other people said.I want people to be better than me.When I was teaching,I never wanted anybody to turn out like me.I wanted them to turn out better than me.
Wynter Johnson:
It's interesting that you talk about messaging that way because I think in some regards,I.I feel like it's okay to be you.There's so many different ways,you know,being a woman can look so different,you know,now there's so many,it doesn't,it's not this prescribed picture the way it was maybe15,20,25years ago.On the flip side,I think you hear more and more thanks to social media and the access of how you should be,how you should wear your makeup,how you should keep your home,how you should raise your kids.And there's so many more people telling you how it should be.And so it's this weird middle ground of I have freedom to be me,but also I should be exactly like this.And it just gets exhausting.
Kris Quintana:
It is so exhausting.And yet,and uh,yesterday there was a commercial on TV for men's hair color,and I had like the secret agent dude dropping in like Mission Impossible.And they're like,dude,you have too many grays.And he covered'em up.And I'm like,I looked at my husband,I said,do you find this as offensive as I do?He was,he stopped at the television.He went,what the heck are you talking about?I was like,it's ageism.It's not okay.It doesn't make it okay to tell women they're not allowed to age just because we tell men they're not allowed to age also.There was a time when society revered their elders,and now it's bad enough women are being told we don't matter over a certain age,but now they're telling men the same thing.It's getting worse.That's not getting better,that's not equality.That's,that's making it worse.So yeah,it is absolutely exhausting.It comes from all sides.And then on top of that,there's the constant,you know,self-checking of,am I showing up?Ha I need to show up as authentically me and not performative,but I also need to make sure that I'm accessible,that I'm not being,um,racist or ageist or ableist or anything-ist because I'm,that's who I am.But how do I do that authentically without crossing over into,I'm doing it for the sake of doing it and still being as inclusive as I wanna be?Which is very,because there's,there's just so many layers and there's so much more ac at you were saying access to it.It,it's,it's utterly exhausting.And I think at some point you just have to say,you know,I'm gonna do the best that I can.I'm gonna be me the best that I can and some people won't like me.And when I make a mistake,I'll own it and apologize and do my best to do better and not try to be perfect.I mean,as nerdy as we wanna be,as heroic as we wanna be.No one's perfect.Now look at all the damage the adventures have done all over the world in all of their films in trying to save the world like.That's actually like a running theme in some of the stories is like,we don't trust them anymore cuz they've messed up New York.Well they were kinda of saving the whole planet,but they still made a mistake.Um,like everybody,nobody's perfect.Not even our heroes.
Wynter Johnson:
Well,and I think when you can say,my goal isn't to be perfect,you allow yourself some freedom there to just be even more you.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.One of my students once said to me,perfection is no longer the goal.Excellence is.
Wynter Johnson:
I like that.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.That was a very smart teenager.
Wynter Johnson:
Uh,Allie and I this year have been talking a lot about progress over perfection.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.
Wynter Johnson:
Yeah.So that can be hard for us.And so progress is,is our goal here.
Kris Quintana:
I love that progress is so important and timelines are important for measuring,like realistic timelines are really,really important when tracking progress as well.
Wynter Johnson:
And recognizing it.I think sometimes we get so frustrated with the one thing we do miss and Allie's really good at this,but she'll say,okay,we didn't get that done,but look at all the other things we did do.Like,it's okay.Like you,we,we've got this.You know?And yeah.Really seeing the big picture helps as well.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.I remember when my husband first started working with a coach,the very first thing that his coach said was,um,I want you to set five goals,and then I want you to tell me how you're gonna celebrate when each of them gets done.Like there wasn't even,it's like you set a goal,you set the celebration.
Wynter Johnson:
And the first thing we'll forego is our celebration because we're,we're tired,we're busy,whatever it is,we'll think we'll celebrate later.
Kris Quintana:
Mm-hmm.
Wynter Johnson:
And I think forcing yourself to celebrate is,is a good goal as well.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.
Wynter Johnson:
So speaking of progress,perfection,uh,you focus a lot on productivity in your coaching as well.I do.Can you talk to us about that and,you know,tips that you have to be productive without being overwhelmed and really just moving forward.
Kris Quintana:
Okay.This is one of the things I love to nerd out about.So,fasten your seat belts.Um,like I just said,like you guys really hit on a really big thing in recognizing what gets done.Our sense of how productive we are is tied to our sense of competence,because if we're not feeling competent,we're not gonna feel like we got anything done.So those two things are really,really important to look at.And so I think,you know,there's this,again,there's these two competing things going on in our culture right now.We're outgrowing hustle and grind.And so what happens when you outgrow something is the pendulum that was over here swings way back the other way.Sometimes the pendulum swings way back the other way when we aren't outgrowing,but we're growing in the right direction and other people are getting uncomfortable.But in general,we get this pendulum swing.So we were too much hustle and grind.So now we know we need to rest,so we rest too much,and then we have to recover from that and we go back to hustle and grind,right?So we swing from burned out to not getting anything done because we haven't found that middle ground.So for me,part of a large part of productivity is what you guys said,which is progress and identifying.So if I,instead of going like this size swing,how do I get it to swing closer to whatever my ideal is?Um,and so you just practice.I mean,nobody wants to hear that.The key to productivity is practice.And it's being willing to scrap it all and start again.So I have my ideal work week.My ideal work week includes getting to my desk at6:00AM and this is actually something that just happens.So this is really good timing.I get to my desk at6:00AM every morning.I spend the first hour of my day writing because I don't do content comfortably.And that's the only hour it's gonna get done.If I don't do it,it won't happen at all.Six to seven I write.And then from seven until nine,the morning's mine,and then I go to work from nine until12or one.And I'm supposed to,supposed to take an hour for lunch and then go to work until five or six.And you know,there's clients in there and there's marketing stuff and there's whatever's going on that week,editing the podcast,recording it,whatever.Um,yesterday I got up to my desk at six.Seven to actually only eight.And I was at my desk from eight to noon.Yeah,I got an extra hour in there,felt really good.Got a lot of stuff done,was heading along,stopped for lunch,didn't get back to work until four.Took a nap,did a second meditation,la la la.Couldn't get my butt up the stairs and back to my office from four until,uh,the appointment,I forgot I had at five.I was killing it.And I had thought like,I have two more hours to go.And I realized if I do six to seven,eight to12,that's five hours,and then I do four to six.That's a seven hour solid of work.That's a reasonably good day.So what if I take the middle of my day and allow myself to do that?Wouldn't that solve,I don't know when to work out.I don't know when to get dinner ready.I don't have enough.Like I need to take a nap.All those things get solved.And I thought,well,that's interesting.Let's try a new schedule.Instead of beating myself up and going,I didn't do anything for four hours.I sat and I went,why didn't I do anything for four hours?What did I need?What else did I get done today?What didn't get done that I could do better?So a lot of it I think,is learning your limits and what works for you and really being willing to experiment.But I think also it's being reasonable.Um,I used to give my coach,I used to have daily check-ins with my coach.I would email her when I got to my desk,whatever,like,Hey,I'm here.Because I wasn't used to working at home instead of in an office,so I needed to check in,right?Um,so hey,I'm at my desk.These are the things I'm doing today.And,uh,at the end of the day,I would say,this is what I got done yesterday.And,you know,so I was like,here's what I finished yesterday.Here's what I'm doing today.Here's what I need help on.So at some point I was lists like this,you know,And eventually my list got this long because we started talking about,she goes,that's not a day's list.That's two weeks worth of stuff.And I think that's part of when people start to be productive.They're like,I have to do everything.I have to get it done yesterday.Who set that timeline?If you have a,you're smiling cuz you're,you're your own boss now.So who set the timeline?The crazy boss.I have no one to blame but me.My boss is insane.Um,but crazy timelines.And suddenly you're like,well,why does it have to happen like this?Why does it have to be today?And when we can breathe a little bit that,see,and this is how we get a balance between hustle and rest.Instead of,it has to get done this week.What if it gets done in two weeks?What if instead of committing in my case to a podcast every single week,I'm releasing one every two weeks.Because I'm new at this,I don't know how to edit.Like it doesn't take long to create a podcast,takes forever to edit one figure out how to get it published and everything.For me,not saying it will for you guys,um,but what if I give myself two weeks instead of one week and I'm not killing myself to get the podcast done because that's not actually my business and my money maker.I actually make business over here coaching,but giving yourself that space and that time and being willing to slow down and trusting that you'll still get results even if it takes a little bit longer to get there.
Wynter Johnson:
It is interesting that you say who set that timeline and I think you know,personally and professionally,and we have a good friend who has two little ones and she was really stressed out of her laundry one day and she said she stopped and realized,no one's making me do this laundry.It's okay for me to go to bed and I can do this tomorrow.There's no one making me.I don't have to do this.Is it nice to have the laundry done?Yes.But is it also nice to get sleep when you really need it?Like choosing to allow yourself some grace to let that laundry sit there.Or in your case,take a nap yesterday if you needed it.If you needed that meditation,give yourself some grace.
Kris Quintana:
Mm-hmm.Yeah.And you know,and when I was talking about creativity,like being creative in how we do things right?Part of productivity is funny.What works for me,you know,for your friend it might work to throw the laundry in the washer,go to bed,and only have to fold it in the morning,right?Depending on what is going on.But h most of us are like,can't leave the laundry in the wash overnight.Why not?I wouldn't leave it for two nights,but like,why not?How often do we turn on the laundry,forget about it,and go,oh yeah,there was laundry,and then throw it in the dryer.It's not that much different than leaving it overnight,but you know,we have,we get so stuck in the way we always saw it done,the way the world tells us it should be.There's a lot more possibilities for how we get things done.Um,I think the videos that I have upon,um,on the app talk about real specific things like the Eisenhower Square and,um,prioritizing and all of that,like I have mine over there.Um,so those are some more tangible things that people could,could listen to and also in terms of productivity.Um,but yeah,I mean,I think productivity is learning.The things I talk to my clients about most are look at your goals on a daily,weekly,monthly basis,um,and plan your day to your goals,and blocking time off.And blocking time is two things.It's like that theory of block time where instead of how many things can I check off my list,it's this is how much time I have to work on it.So what can get done in this period of time?But it's also scheduling those blocks for the things that matter to you.So if you're gonna write a book and you note don't have any time anywhere,it never gets done.Which is why I was saying I get to my desk at6:00AM cause I needed an extra hour in the day.I'm not gonna work out at six.There's no people to talk to at six.I'm kind of groggy and it's,I'm not really human so what could I do?I could do the content that I don't like to do first thing when I have good strong willpower to do it.
Wynter Johnson:
And I like that too cuz it's kind of the swallow the frog mentality of,you know,if I have that over my head the whole day,I,I,I go to great lengths to avoid it.Like,it is amazing what I will do to avoid projects I don't wanna do when I know if I just block that time and get it done,the rest of my day is so much better.
Kris Quintana:
Can,and let me ask you about the end of the day when you have avoided it all day and it's been hanging over your head all day,how do you feel about how productive you've been?
Wynter Johnson:
Well,I don't feel great.Even if I did a hundred other things,I don't.
Kris Quintana:
Exactly.
Wynter Johnson:
And then often what happens is I don't wanna do it and so I let it go into the next day and I might have this cycle for3,4,5days with this same thing I'm avoiding over my head and instead of just taking the hour to get it done,it can ruin my week.
Kris Quintana:
Yeah.And so,um,I think I just wrote,my last blog post was about this,about finding,um,escape velocity.Um,I was talking to a friend of mine about marketing and she was saying how,um,marketing isn't about convincing somebody that they wanna buy something they don't wanna buy.Marketing is about convincing somebody who wants your services to take the action and get off off their button and change the channel,right?Like it's inertia.And what you were des describing is a form of inertia.And I think that's one of the things that gets in our way all the time,is it's just easy.I'm already doing something in this direction and it's hard to change gears and come back.And that's part of why I eat the frog first works because you don't have to overcome momentum in a different direction.You only have to get started.But if you're taking a break,if you're eating lunch,if you're watching television,if you're doing a task for your bus for something else that's more fun than the thing you need to do,you're not gonna wanna do it.Like I used to have parents come to me and go,I don't know what to do.My kid argues about coming to this class all the time when we get here.He has a great time,but getting him is such a,here is such a fight.I can't get him out the door.The first thing I always ask is,what are they doing before you come to class?Oh,they're outside running around and playing.I'm like,okay.Easiest way to get them to come to class.Don't let them play aft af between school and class and they won't do I,I,I can't do that.I'm like,okay,well then you're gonna keep fighting this battle.But like,if they had to come home,eat a snack,sit quietly,and then do homework,wouldn't they wanna come to class?Cuz now they get to play.And also they'd be done with their homework earlier and they'd get to play later.Like,you're having trouble getting your kid,your third grader to stop playing,come do their homework.What a surprise.What if play became the reward for home?I'm not gonna stop playing and do homework either.I wanna go play,but if I do my homework first and then I go play work before play,right?So some of that,a lot of it is inertia and,and gaining momentum to get over that inertia.
Wynter Johnson:
Well,and you're right,once you get that first task done,then you feel so motivated throughout the rest of it.You're like,I've got this.The rest of this,we're on it.
Kris Quintana:
I've got this.I did the worst thing,I did the hardest thing.Everything else from here is easy.If I could do that,I could do this.And,and you don't have to look back20years to the World Championship title.You only have to look back to seven o'clock this morning or whatever time you,you did it.Right.Now,for some people,the magic hour is later in the evening.Like this is a Craig Valentine thing.Like he talks about finding your sweet spot and knowing what your magic hour is,where you're going to be most productive.And then that's when you do that most important thing.So for some people it doesn't work.Some people have been kicking themselves going,I'm trying to eat the frog first.Everybody says,do the most important thing first,but I can't ever get anything done in the morning,so what am I?Don't do it in the morning.Find what works best for you.When are you most productive?And that goes back to,you know,doing it your way and not the way everybody else tells you to do it.For some of us,that's gonna be first thing in the morning and,and I've started realizing yesterday for20years,I ran a martial arts studio.I either went to my day job or got up early in the morning and I worked from6,630to two,and then I taught from three until nine.So is it any wonder that now I don't wanna work from two o'clock to four o'clock?Duh,it's been20years.That's my habit.Is it good?Maybe,maybe not.But that's my habit.So I can force myself to change or I can embrace it.I go,that's the way I work.So what am I gonna do from two to four that's gonna feel really good and make me wanna work again?And how am I gonna make up that time?That's interesting.Your body and your mind,you're used to that schedule.That makes complete sense that that's what you're wanting to do now,naturally.Yeah.I mean it was pre pandemic and some of us have a hard time remembering BC before Covid,but um,we,it,it existed and it's who we were.Um,my life doesn't look anything like that anymore.Some of which is by design and some is not.But at some point you're like,oh hey,this is kind of a muscle memory.Like two o'clock is my break.So,cause I would stop and we would transition from working at home to working at the school.Um,or I would sit in traffic and commute from work to the school,whatever period of my life I was in.But it was like a good20years of,um,well15cuz I worked full-time for a while,but it was a long time of not having to work in those hours.So it's.I can fight it or I can work with it.And I think that's one of the most important productivity things too,right?The neurodivergent people are trying to put themselves in these,these round holes that were not drawn for them.And um,it's one of the biggest challenges as an adult with ADHD,is how do I make my life work when my life doesn't work the way all of the experts on productivity say it should.
Wynter Johnson:
Well,and knowing what works for you is huge and being okay with it,working for you is another thing.You know,Allie and I talk a lot about how our life looks very different now than before Covid,and I don't know that I could ever do or want to do that again,but somehow I also feel guilty for not still doing that.It's a really uncomfortable place to be.
Kris Quintana:
Because we still live in a capitalist society that,as you said earlier in this conversation,values people based on how much money they contribute to society.And so there's that piece hanging over you of,it doesn't look like the corporate world that we were all raised into.Um,but there is another side of this,and that's the side of,it's not,you know,saying find what works for you is not permission to not change.Right.The,the person I was talking about that was saying I said,doesn't do order well,but that means that their strength is chaos.They want to do order better for themselves and for their kids.So that's worth working on.That's not like you say,oh,I'm a disorganized person.I'm never gonna be organized.Right?We can change.We are all capable of doing the work to teach ourselves to do something.But when you're trying something over and over and it's not working,maybe it's at some point it becomes worth taking a different approach.And sometimes that,and all of that involves allowing yourself to be,to find what works for you.So,you know,maybe this person's version of organization will be different looking,but it will still be better organized.And it will be a system that,hey,that works for me and my kids.And you know,when the kids are grown and outta school,it may not work the same way anymore.And that's something they'll have to figure out on their own as they go.But you know,it's worth,it's not like I don't have to change.Right.I'm not saying we get to sit back on our.Or problems and just,oh,I am who I am.I don't have to change.Meh,some of us have things we need to work on and,and that's important to be willing to,to at least attempt,but it's,it's that,it's that pendulum and that balancing act of how do you find that middle ground?
Wynter Johnson:
Such a tricky thing to find in so many different ways.
Kris Quintana:
I know.
Allie Nickle:
Um,oh,I have so many different thoughts I could go with on this.I know we need to wrap up here pretty quick.Um,but one of the things just to go along with this conversation,um,I saw,I think it was a reel on Instagram the other day.I follow a lot of mom Instagram,uh,accounts,having a three year old,and one of them said something that stuck with me of my self worth is not based on if my toddler had a tantrum today.And I think.That,but also my self-worth is not tied to if I was productive for eight hours at my computer today.Um,and I keep going back to that and I think,um,the US especially is really bad at that.Um,I can't speak to other cultures as much obviously,but um,I think there's so much to this that's tied to self-worth too.And productivity is not tied to self-worth.Um,our company is not tied to our self-worth or shouldn't be.It needs to be,are we fulfilled,are we happy?And then because of that,we're more fulfilled,we are more productive,we can move forward and help more people.So that's just kind of what's been swimming around in my head this whole time while we've been talking.
Kris Quintana:
I think that's really beautiful and I think it kind of ties everything all together too,because you're you to,if you say to someone who has no sense of self worth,that your self worth is not your business,your child,whatever,that's terrifying.Yes.So to someone who has been given messages throughout their childhood,that there's something wrong with that inner nerd part of them and hasn't been able to start saying,this is who I am,right?I'm a storyteller.Like when you said that you disengaged,I'm a storyteller.The podcast will be successful or it won't.The podcast will be what it's gonna be,but I'm still a storyteller,and who I am isn't gonna be lessened.I don't have to shrink based on those results.And when you realize that about your child,that your self worth is not tied to your child,what freedom does that give your child in terms of being who they are?And you start breaking a cycle.You start breaking a cycle and start allowing your child to develop their sense of self-worth independently of you and independently of their results.And that starts causing healing.Right.So as we heal it in ourselves,we're healing it for the next generation.And,and that's really powerful too.I think what you,you hit on that of we need to know who we are.We need to know how to value ourselves,um,in order to like move out and start shifting these paradigms that we've been saddled with.
Allie Nickle:
Only a little thing to,you know,break the entire cycle of human behavior from the last several generations.
Kris Quintana:
A paradigms is nothing more than20cents.It's not that big a deal.
Allie Nickle:
Yes,exactly.Well,thanks for tuning into the See You in the AM podcast.We're your host,Allie Nickle and Wynter Johnson.And a very special thanks to Kris for taking the time to chat with us today.
Kris Quintana:
Thank you guys for having me.That was a lot of fun.
Allie Nickle:
Uh,our goal at Aspyn Market is to make mental health,self-guided therapy and coaching resources available to everyone,and we just skimmed the surface today.If anything we discussed resonated with you and you're interested in learning more to help your mental health,please check out our app,Aspyn Coaching,where you can get unlimited access to hundreds of hours of self-guided therapy and coaching from our team of Aspyn Coaches.Just head over to AspynMarket.com.That's Aspyn with a y to start your seven day free trial now.Get full access to all of our features for seven days,including featured daily videos,guided journeys,journal prompts,downloadable resources and exercises.The path to a happier,healthier you starts here.Until our next episode,we hope you have a wonderful day and we'll see you in the AM.